| Power to the People |
The site is officially yours 
What does this mean? I'm giving this website to you, the loyal members of BandAMP. I'm giving away all rights to commercialize this property. This doesn't mean I wont be helping in future development... it just means, now you can participate in bringing this community into its true potential.
So what's next? I'm going to setup a Non-Profit Organization, so BandAMP will not only officially belong to you, but legally as well. This way, you, the members, will have complete control in the future of BandAMP!
Pitch in to help make the website truly be, for musicians, by musicians. Do you know PHP, Javascript, or Flash? Perhaps you're a great website designer, or a writer who wants to extend the FAQs, About Us, et cetera. If you have an idea you'd like to implement, contact Jim who will be divvying out server access to start working on the code. Btw, is there some way you'd guys preferably meet online? We could have developer chats on IRC to get people coordinated. It might be easier for some people if there was a separate chartroom on BandAMP for developers.
BandAMP code will become Open Source (GPL) once the it's been looked over by a few members (and perhaps some bugs, security issues, ect. may need to be fixed). It will be released on NoFunc a website some friends, and myself, have been depositing random bits of GPL'd code. There's a lot of tidbits in there that could be useful, especially this playlist editor that allows you to reorganize your music, rate music, edit titles in place, and so on. I've not had a chance to tie it into the database or make sure it works in Internet Explorer, so someone could volunteer expedite that. Also, maybe a layout more like this would be more appropriate for the amp... (of coarse with different content)
This kind of development has worked for Wikipedia, Linux, and many other popular projects. Let's make it work for us.
What does this mean? I'm giving this website to you, the loyal members of BandAMP. I'm giving away all rights to commercialize this property. This doesn't mean I wont be helping in future development... it just means, now you can participate in bringing this community into its true potential.So what's next? I'm going to setup a Non-Profit Organization, so BandAMP will not only officially belong to you, but legally as well. This way, you, the members, will have complete control in the future of BandAMP!
Pitch in to help make the website truly be, for musicians, by musicians. Do you know PHP, Javascript, or Flash? Perhaps you're a great website designer, or a writer who wants to extend the FAQs, About Us, et cetera. If you have an idea you'd like to implement, contact Jim who will be divvying out server access to start working on the code. Btw, is there some way you'd guys preferably meet online? We could have developer chats on IRC to get people coordinated. It might be easier for some people if there was a separate chartroom on BandAMP for developers.
BandAMP code will become Open Source (GPL) once the it's been looked over by a few members (and perhaps some bugs, security issues, ect. may need to be fixed). It will be released on NoFunc a website some friends, and myself, have been depositing random bits of GPL'd code. There's a lot of tidbits in there that could be useful, especially this playlist editor that allows you to reorganize your music, rate music, edit titles in place, and so on. I've not had a chance to tie it into the database or make sure it works in Internet Explorer, so someone could volunteer expedite that. Also, maybe a layout more like this would be more appropriate for the amp... (of coarse with different content)
This kind of development has worked for Wikipedia, Linux, and many other popular projects. Let's make it work for us.
Once all the Bugs & Security Issues (if there are any) are fixed, and the code is cleaned up (to be more easily readable) the code will become Open Source. This means you could setup a BandAMP server on your computer to help develop the website further, or, if you wanted, you could even setup your own BandAMP knockoff. (I dunno, maybe someone wants to make a rap amp, huh, the domain is available).
Once the non-profit organization is setup it might be a good idea to start taking tax-deductible donations for prizes, or maybe advertising (printing flyers), or whatever else may come up. This is something we'll have to figure out when the time comes. I, for one, would love to donate some money to a good cause like that.
Once the non-profit organization is setup it might be a good idea to start taking tax-deductible donations for prizes, or maybe advertising (printing flyers), or whatever else may come up. This is something we'll have to figure out when the time comes. I, for one, would love to donate some money to a good cause like that.
Later this year we should meet up at Burning Man, by then the Non-Profit Organization should be formed (with any luck), then we can have an official meeting, and enjoy some live music in the process.
I made a search for bandAmp on Digg.com, came up with zilch , I didn't want to 'digg it' at the time, my reasoning being that a rightly timed 'digg it' can be a massive impact on a site, and a bandAmp mySpace was rather left in the hands of Mud when it was brought up before.
So now we have a licence to kill !!! ???
So has JimKs status has been raised from Mod to Admin? How is contacting Jim if we want to develop the site going to help?
If we all agree on say (for the sake of argument) a new lyrics tab, JimK goes abracadabra and it happens?
I don't mean to sound cynical I'm just trying to get to what it might mean in every day reality.
If we feel like it we can run an advertising campaign for bandAmp? or must it first be discussed with Jim and agreed by members?
We need Flyers (Flyers what?) so Jim has to pay for that and organise distribution for them to be further distributed?
We need a 'paypal' button with an account and a trusted administration behind it! how do we get that sorted?
As I see it now : you change the sites status, it remains free, JimK gets loads of e-mails !
We the members don't get to change anything until it's open source, but it has to be fully functional before that !!!
Just trying to put things in perspective.
Comments aside, my deepest gratitude for the site just the same.
So now we have a licence to kill !!! ???
So has JimKs status has been raised from Mod to Admin? How is contacting Jim if we want to develop the site going to help?
If we all agree on say (for the sake of argument) a new lyrics tab, JimK goes abracadabra and it happens?
I don't mean to sound cynical I'm just trying to get to what it might mean in every day reality.
If we feel like it we can run an advertising campaign for bandAmp? or must it first be discussed with Jim and agreed by members?
We need Flyers (Flyers what?) so Jim has to pay for that and organise distribution for them to be further distributed?
We need a 'paypal' button with an account and a trusted administration behind it! how do we get that sorted?
As I see it now : you change the sites status, it remains free, JimK gets loads of e-mails !
We the members don't get to change anything until it's open source, but it has to be fully functional before that !!!
Just trying to put things in perspective.
Comments aside, my deepest gratitude for the site just the same.
i no nuthin about code or open source crap but i can talk and when the moment is right spread the word of the amp to all musicians in the tri-county area
| ok |
Kings,
I have the access needed to implement the changes, and though it wont go Abracadabra, I am ready to start working with those who can go abracadabra, and already Avi has stepped up and pledged his allegiance to the amp, he is sending me all the money in his account, and will send me regular payments of $400 a month to be a member of the AMP ELITE..
ok, not really, but he has graciously agreed to help however he can. So, I now want to get as many people together as I can, in skype, or here in the chatroom, and we can discuss the main things that we need to change, and implement... And who will be doing the coding.. I will give them the proper access information, and they can go to town... WOO HOO!!! Power to the People indeed... This is a MOMENTOUS OCCASION!!!
JimK
I have the access needed to implement the changes, and though it wont go Abracadabra, I am ready to start working with those who can go abracadabra, and already Avi has stepped up and pledged his allegiance to the amp, he is sending me all the money in his account, and will send me regular payments of $400 a month to be a member of the AMP ELITE..
ok, not really, but he has graciously agreed to help however he can. So, I now want to get as many people together as I can, in skype, or here in the chatroom, and we can discuss the main things that we need to change, and implement... And who will be doing the coding.. I will give them the proper access information, and they can go to town... WOO HOO!!! Power to the People indeed... This is a MOMENTOUS OCCASION!!!
JimK
kings wrote…
I made a search for bandAmp on Digg.com, came up with zilch , I didn't want to 'digg it' at the time, my reasoning being that a rightly timed 'digg it' can be a massive impact on a site, and a bandAmp mySpace was rather left in the hands of Mud when it was brought up before.
So now we have a licence to kill !!! ???
So has JimKs status has been raised from Mod to Admin? How is contacting Jim if we want to develop the site going to help?
If we all agree on say (for the sake of argument) a new lyrics tab, JimK goes abracadabra and it happens?
I don't mean to sound cynical I'm just trying to get to what it might mean in every day reality.
If we feel like it we can run an advertising campaign for bandAmp? or must it first be discussed with Jim and agreed by members?
We need Flyers (Flyers what?) so Jim has to pay for that and organise distribution for them to be further distributed?
We need a 'paypal' button with an account and a trusted administration behind it! how do we get that sorted?
As I see it now : you change the sites status, it remains free, JimK gets loads of e-mails !
We the members don't get to change anything until it's open source, but it has to be fully functional before that !!!
Just trying to put things in perspective.
Comments aside, my deepest gratitude for the site just the same.
You've misunderstood the idea here. Jim is not in charge of implementing the changes, he's in charge of giving out access to people who want to make changes. Jim could also give someone else access that he trusts, to give out access to other members (if there's a really good unix admin out there, that would be helpful).
As far as digg, that would be awesome :DBut, I agree with you, now is not the right time. We need to wait till any bugs and kinks are worked out, and things are running smoothly.
As far as donations, you've gotta wait till the NPO is setup. And yes, I believe that's how NPO's work, someone has to be in charge of the money, and, no, it doesn't have to be Jim. This person would be the treasurer.
As far as flyers, I was just thinking something people could put in music shops for musicians pick up. And again, no, Jim doesn't need to be in charge of this. You've gotta think of this more like a (non-evil) Borg Collective (for you Star Trek fans out there).
Oh, and BTW, yes, things have changed. Now you can gain access to the code and make changes... That's a huge difference. The server is all ready to be developed. This the 1st step. Once the code is all nice and tidy, we go to phase two, where it's all GPL'd (Open Source). The 2nd step is great, because it will allow a much wider audience to work on the code with greater ease, but we need to make sure the code is bullet proof 1st.
And as soon as possible I'll get the NPO setup (3rd step)... but truly, in my opinion, this last step is the most superficial of all... Although, it definitely sounds cool, and is also very beneficial!
And as soon as possible I'll get the NPO setup (3rd step)... but truly, in my opinion, this last step is the most superficial of all... Although, it definitely sounds cool, and is also very beneficial!
sweet-- this sounds great. It'll really give the members more than one way to help other musicians.
Good stuff, friends! I suppose we ought to get on those "kinks" we all talk about sometimes... making the code "bulletproof" like mud said.
thanks a million mud, from the beginnings of this site until now, we've seen great things come about, and now I think you've put this in a position to develope even more! Thanks for paying for those servers, too :P That's certainly no small affair for a member of bandamp at random. You're the best!
Later,
TLS
Good stuff, friends! I suppose we ought to get on those "kinks" we all talk about sometimes... making the code "bulletproof" like mud said.
thanks a million mud, from the beginnings of this site until now, we've seen great things come about, and now I think you've put this in a position to develope even more! Thanks for paying for those servers, too :P That's certainly no small affair for a member of bandamp at random. You're the best!
Later,
TLS
unix ? i went to school for unix but it's been awhile, but........ I can contact friend of mine John Andrews (great guitar player) he is or was one of the unix admin at sprint.. he might want to help out, not sure but I can always ask.
oh yeah and this is good news.. Is downchuck still going to help out some? Not sure if all the improvements were by him or you, but the sight is doing much better now. I will help out any way I can but I am not familiar with php code and not enough experience with unix. but I can help make some industry contacts if we want to go that route.
toastedgoat wrote…
oh yeah and this is good news.. Is downchuck still going to help out some? Not sure if all the improvements were by him or you, but the sight is doing much better now. I will help out any way I can but I am not familiar with php code and not enough experience with unix. but I can help make some industry contacts if we want to go that route.
Yup, chuck should still be around from time to time as well. I'm actually down at his house right now taking care of his cat while he's traveling on business
He's the one who's been working on the site recently, working out some of the kinks and optimizing the speed.Any help would be great! I believe Jim mentioned a member here on BandAMP who's good with Unix administration who was willing to help out as well. We probably only need one or two Unix admins, any more would probably be overkill right now. PHP is something that would definitely be helpful, I don't think we can have too many people working on the actual code... especially once it's been cleaned a little.
Has anyone here worked on an Open Source project before? Or perhaps has known someone who has? It might be helpful to hear your experience to help this translation go by smoothly, as we might be able to learn from mistakes, or successes.
JimK wrote…
This is a MOMENTOUS OCCASION!!!
As for Jim being king, he is our gracious noodle king and one of our 'two wise mods' and as far as I'm concerned I wouldn't want anyone else as site coordinator , Jim's our main man, King of the Congo !!
Cheers Mud for the clarity, (and of course for all that you're doing) Realising that this is a 'momentous moment' for all who sincerely care for bandAmp and all that this site is and stands for, I just want to open those curtains as wide as possible !!
Can we have a 'Here here!'
- Cheers!!!!!
- Cheers!!!!!
I'm excited for this. I've got experience in code and Linux. I've worked on open source projects from a 32-bit BASIC compiler to submitting patches for big, mainstream OSS. I wish I had time to commit to this fully and openly (sometimes I wish I had the time that I did in high school), but short of working on this full-time, I will commit as much of my free time as I can to working on the code, server and everything that needs work.
The future of the AMP is finally becoming the perfect musician community that I've been looking for.
MAP, it's "hear hear".
The future of the AMP is finally becoming the perfect musician community that I've been looking for.
MAP, it's "hear hear"
.Yeah Whatever, NERD!! :P jk Avi..
| Design |
Oh and I worked up a quick mockup a while ago for a new Bandamp design (view in firefox please at the moment)
http://www.emptysnow.com/sandbox/bandamp/
I'd personally LOVE to get the chance to lead the design of Bandamp. That would be the coolest experience.
http://www.emptysnow.com/sandbox/bandamp/
I'd personally LOVE to get the chance to lead the design of Bandamp. That would be the coolest experience.
Ok here are my props to Mud put more eloquently:
Mud, you built a site out of nothing, one that serves as a home base for so many musicians. It's given us all a lot more courage and excited us. It's made us better guitarists, singers, rappers, whistlers. You created a community that is so unique on the web -- we're all friends. And for months you've taken our whining and shit about improving the site; not only that, but you didn't just ignore it. You went the extra step, and now you're actually providing BandAMP a way to continue indefinitely even if you're not here. You've had the talent and foresight to build this community and keep it going and I think everyone agrees with me when I say you seriously rock our socks.
Mud, you built a site out of nothing, one that serves as a home base for so many musicians. It's given us all a lot more courage and excited us. It's made us better guitarists, singers, rappers, whistlers. You created a community that is so unique on the web -- we're all friends. And for months you've taken our whining and shit about improving the site; not only that, but you didn't just ignore it. You went the extra step, and now you're actually providing BandAMP a way to continue indefinitely even if you're not here. You've had the talent and foresight to build this community and keep it going and I think everyone agrees with me when I say you seriously rock our socks.
woah.. a quadruple post... easy, buddy 
we had a discussion about doing a wiki once... the final result was that we wanted to wait a bit before doing such a thing
as for the site design... i think your idea is good, but it's not modern enough to capture my attention the way that the current bandamp does. maybe it's just the color scheme...? I love web design, personally, but i don't know how much time i can commit to this, recording my music like a normal musician would want to, go to university, work, and have a working relationship with the girlfriend all at the same time :P
i saw a suggestion about using more flash in such a new design, but i'd hesitate to turn the whole thing flash, unless it's done extrememly well and broken up in to segmented movies. Even at that, I'd like to keep bandamp rather robust in design we don't wanna go too Flash-y
When i was consulting a bit with entheon, last time we had a bandamp skin-change, it was quite extensive, and really helpful. We owe a lot to his ideas! hard to believe that was 2+ years ago... wow. Anyway.
final answer: if design gets a revamp, it's gotta be done in the highest class of css coding... we don't want any goofy going on. looking over your code, ZachBlume, it's a little hard-coded and not very reliant on style-sheets and such. that's not fatal at the moment, as you're just trying to show us a design idea, but still. hey, check out the source of the main bandamp page and grab the css sheet that it's linking to. Entheon and I had a little talk over how bandamp looks right now, and it was really really helpful to analyze the css file to really get a feel for how bandamp was running.
we had a discussion about doing a wiki once... the final result was that we wanted to wait a bit before doing such a thing
as for the site design... i think your idea is good, but it's not modern enough to capture my attention the way that the current bandamp does. maybe it's just the color scheme...? I love web design, personally, but i don't know how much time i can commit to this, recording my music like a normal musician would want to, go to university, work, and have a working relationship with the girlfriend all at the same time :P
i saw a suggestion about using more flash in such a new design, but i'd hesitate to turn the whole thing flash, unless it's done extrememly well and broken up in to segmented movies. Even at that, I'd like to keep bandamp rather robust in design
we don't wanna go too Flash-y When i was consulting a bit with entheon, last time we had a bandamp skin-change, it was quite extensive, and really helpful. We owe a lot to his ideas! hard to believe that was 2+ years ago... wow. Anyway.
final answer: if design gets a revamp, it's gotta be done in the highest class of css coding... we don't want any goofy going on. looking over your code, ZachBlume, it's a little hard-coded and not very reliant on style-sheets and such. that's not fatal at the moment, as you're just trying to show us a design idea, but still. hey, check out the source of the main bandamp page and grab the css sheet that it's linking to. Entheon and I had a little talk over how bandamp looks right now, and it was really really helpful to analyze the css file to really get a feel for how bandamp was running.
Here's a listing of all the current stylesheets: https://www.bandamp.org/css/
They're fairly well organized (especially forum.css), but definitely could use some cleaning.
Once it's nice and clean, something like csszengarden.com could be done, where people could choose their own theme.
They're fairly well organized (especially forum.css), but definitely could use some cleaning.
Once it's nice and clean, something like csszengarden.com could be done, where people could choose their own theme.
I do think the main page could 'maybe' do with a little revamping, just to make it more slick, modern and eye catching but otherwise I REALLY like how the Amps pages are right now, soft colours , plenty of (white) space a design that's easy on the eye where you can enjoy what is posted with little or no 'other' distractions.
Having tried my hand at a few forum set-ups (Emergency Forum) I've come to realize that some sites 'have it' while others just don't. It's an absolute art designing a web site. If you were to check out Muds other sites you'd see his general 'style' and approach ; functional, unobtrusive, soft, spacious, easy-going and professional.
I like Mud and I like his sight !
Giving bandAmp users (or only members lol ) the possibility to not only view the site in the design they choose but to also design their own bandAmp (if only with CSS) is an amazing concept, an excellent sales pitch / recruiter and one more brilliant idea to add to the many that would make bandAmp simply unserpassable!
But.....it is a music site and 'design your own' would always be an 'extra commodity' and a lot of work !!??
Tell you what Zach, you design a really cool bandAmp (?related?) site and I'll let you put it up at bandamp.us.
If your looking for experience and publicity of your own !
So let me get this clear, it's a misty morning here! ;
There is a general site wide agreement that 'we' 'the site' do not Digg it, MySpace it, youTube it, Wiki it or any thing publicity wise, in the name of bandAmp, until a certain moment in time has been reached when the site is 'OK' and 'Good to go!' ? Yes? No?
Having tried my hand at a few forum set-ups (Emergency Forum) I've come to realize that some sites 'have it' while others just don't. It's an absolute art designing a web site. If you were to check out Muds other sites you'd see his general 'style' and approach ; functional, unobtrusive, soft, spacious, easy-going and professional.
I like Mud and I like his sight !
Giving bandAmp users (or only members lol ) the possibility to not only view the site in the design they choose but to also design their own bandAmp (if only with CSS) is an amazing concept, an excellent sales pitch / recruiter and one more brilliant idea to add to the many that would make bandAmp simply unserpassable!
But.....it is a music site and 'design your own' would always be an 'extra commodity' and a lot of work !!??
Tell you what Zach, you design a really cool bandAmp (?related?) site and I'll let you put it up at bandamp.us.
If your looking for experience and publicity of your own !
So let me get this clear, it's a misty morning here! ;
There is a general site wide agreement that 'we' 'the site' do not Digg it, MySpace it, youTube it, Wiki it or any thing publicity wise, in the name of bandAmp, until a certain moment in time has been reached when the site is 'OK' and 'Good to go!' ? Yes? No?
we hesitated about the wiki thing because we didn't want to come off as if we were advertising it yet... there were plenty of small farm defenders, if you will. people have liked the small community feel that they've had here, and they were afraid to trash it by opening bandamp up to more publicity that would attract (perhaps) TOO many casual, non-interactive users that wouldn't really be contributing to the site at this stage of it's development.
So, short answer to your question, kings: Yes. That seems to be the general consensus.
So, short answer to your question, kings: Yes. That seems to be the general consensus.
@Kings.
Ever been to a forum like http://www.bungie.net?
That is one busy forum. And I couldn't name you a single member. Not a single member could name me, though I post regularly enough. There's not really a community, you know what I mean?
Not sure if that's really relevant enough to waste your guys' time. But while I'm here, I might as well say,
While I've been here, it seems like BandAMP has evolved into a think-tank kind of thing just as much a music site. As much as I would love to contribute as much as humanly possible, I have no experience in any code of any kind. The old get old, the young get stronger. But I sure like to think. The products of my brain are at your disposal, BandAMP community.
And I thought, with such easy access and user control, we have the question, what is everyone going to DO?
Well I'll tell you what everyone is gonna do, everyone is gonna do everything. As has been sad, Jim will get more emails than he can possibly handle. If there is going to be a big chat meeting, there needs to be some way to limit the amount of overwhelming petitioning for everyone's personal opinion. This site is heading straight for the wonderful land of Democracy, and as we all know, that's the hardest land there is to get to.
Or at least to stay in.
So as much as we all want this to be free-Democracy-everyone-has-an-equal-say, we are gonna need plenty of structure to keep this working smoothly.
Some kind of a Speaker of the House?
This (post) is going on too long.
Ever been to a forum like http://www.bungie.net?
That is one busy forum. And I couldn't name you a single member. Not a single member could name me, though I post regularly enough. There's not really a community, you know what I mean?
Not sure if that's really relevant enough to waste your guys' time. But while I'm here, I might as well say,
While I've been here, it seems like BandAMP has evolved into a think-tank kind of thing just as much a music site. As much as I would love to contribute as much as humanly possible, I have no experience in any code of any kind. The old get old, the young get stronger. But I sure like to think. The products of my brain are at your disposal, BandAMP community.
And I thought, with such easy access and user control, we have the question, what is everyone going to DO?
Well I'll tell you what everyone is gonna do, everyone is gonna do everything. As has been sad, Jim will get more emails than he can possibly handle. If there is going to be a big chat meeting, there needs to be some way to limit the amount of overwhelming petitioning for everyone's personal opinion. This site is heading straight for the wonderful land of Democracy, and as we all know, that's the hardest land there is to get to.
Or at least to stay in.
So as much as we all want this to be free-Democracy-everyone-has-an-equal-say, we are gonna need plenty of structure to keep this working smoothly.
Some kind of a Speaker of the House?
This (post) is going on too long.
Wow! So I don't log in here for a week and a bit and it's all change (well, nearly) for BandAMP... this is good news as far as I'm concerned.
It follows on from months and months of people debating the demise of a great site and a pretty close web community, so from me it's very much a:
THANK YOU MUD
It follows on from months and months of people debating the demise of a great site and a pretty close web community, so from me it's very much a:
THANK YOU MUD
Ok, so here's the update: We've got a lawyer in Seattle who is setting up the Non-Profit Organization (NPO). This part of the process shouldn't take too much time, however, the government has made it difficult for NPO's to gain tax deductibility status in the last twenty years or so (as a result of people trying to evade taxes). SO, what I've heard is it will take an additional 6-8 months AFTER the NPO is setup before it can be approved for tax deductibility. Not much we can do here to speed that process up.
Anyways, just wanted to let you guys know we're working on it!
Anyways, just wanted to let you guys know we're working on it!
What a thing to jump back into!
Is there an IRC server up or a channel somewhere? I wouldn't mind idling. I'm more likely to chat to band amp users via mIRC than I am through the website at the moment, whether for development or music. (I think there should be a channel for each :P).
I wouldn't mind contributing so I might setup a UK ninjam server for users... just need some people to try it out possibly..
Is there an IRC server up or a channel somewhere? I wouldn't mind idling. I'm more likely to chat to band amp users via mIRC than I am through the website at the moment, whether for development or music. (I think there should be a channel for each :P).
I wouldn't mind contributing so I might setup a UK ninjam server for users... just need some people to try it out possibly.
.aar0j wrote…
What a thing to jump back into!
Is there an IRC server up or a channel somewhere? I wouldn't mind idling. I'm more likely to chat to band amp users via mIRC than I am through the website at the moment, whether for development or music. (I think there should be a channel for each :P).
I wouldn't mind contributing so I might setup a UK ninjam server for users... just need some people to try it out possibly.
Nope, not IRC channel. You could set something like that up, but, really, not sure how many people know how to use IRC, as it's still not very mainstream (at least not so much as say, Jabber, MSN, or AIM). It would be cool if the IRC actually connected to the chatroom on BandAMP (so when you post on either, it shows up on the other one as well), but not sure how to make that work.
IRC on the AMP? That's doable---usually people use a Java applet, however. Hacking the functionality into Lace is next to impossible. I'm just thinking out loud here: PHP has sockets functionality, but once the page has loaded and the script stops executing, the connection will close. Even if you have a separate script running in the background, you'll max out the server connection timeout. It's doable with some server tweaks, but definitely not worth it, I don't think.
For the record, I'd happily use IRC. It's my preferred means of messenging, but yeah, it requires a certain level of tech-geekiness. Most of my friends aren't going to install an IRC client. I mainly use it for the development chat.
For the record, I'd happily use IRC. It's my preferred means of messenging, but yeah, it requires a certain level of tech-geekiness. Most of my friends aren't going to install an IRC client. I mainly use it for the development chat.
avinashv wrote…
IRC on the AMP? That's doable---usually people use a Java applet, however. Hacking the functionality into Lace is next to impossible. I'm just thinking out loud here: PHP has sockets functionality, but once the page has loaded and the script stops executing, the connection will close. Even if you have a separate script running in the background, you'll max out the server connection timeout. It's doable with some server tweaks, but definitely not worth it, I don't think.
For the record, I'd happily use IRC. It's my preferred means of messenging, but yeah, it requires a certain level of tech-geekiness. Most of my friends aren't going to install an IRC client. I mainly use it for the development chat.
Hmm... Yeah, you'd have to do some javascript timeout's that just check to see whether there are updates on the server... so it really couldn't be in REAL TIME. However, I believe that's how lace works... so the reaction times would be quite similar to how Lace is now... Which really isn't too quick, and kinda sucks when you get a few people chatting at once.
Btw, avinashv, what programming languages do you know? It sounds like you've got some good knowledge there. I've never really messed around with Java, just PHP/SQL/Javascript. AKA, the basic web programming languages.
Lace uses the concept of AJAX...it asynchronously (via Javascript) serves a PHP page that polls a database for a new entry and displays it. An IRC server operates differently. To receive messages, you have to be authenticated by the centralized server (e.g. efnet), logged into a room and then connected over a period of time. Continuously polling the same script via JScript won't work because each time the script is polled, the connection is simultaneously lost and regained...forcing reauthentication each time. AFAIK, an IRC server would ban anything trying to get authentication that many times a second.
Lace's response can be improved by reducing the interval between script polls. It's absurdly high given it's short spurts of text. It's not the greatest system anyway...
I am familiar with (I won't list the non-web development related ones): XML/HTML, XSL, CSS, Javascript, PHP, Python, Ruby, and a little bit of Erlang---though I would never use Erlang. Professionally, I've programmed in Python using Plone over Zope (commercial-level frameworks) for my university, and PHP for various projects. I guess I can say I know SQL, but I prefer to use database abstraction frameworks for ease of use and extensibility...something like ActiveRecord or SQLAlchemy...although I know my way around SQLite and mySQL enough to hold my own.
I've been in the 'game' for 8 or 9 years now. HTML 4 was 'the big thing' when I started web development, which puts us in the late 90's. I didn't use CSS for a while (good old font, center, bold and italic tags, eh?). I started with server-side scripting somewhere in the early 2000's with PHP. Python is new...I probably have 3 years experience. Ruby is year-and-a-half, and Erlang is something like 1 week 5 weeks ago.
Lace's response can be improved by reducing the interval between script polls. It's absurdly high given it's short spurts of text. It's not the greatest system anyway...
I am familiar with (I won't list the non-web development related ones): XML/HTML, XSL, CSS, Javascript, PHP, Python, Ruby, and a little bit of Erlang---though I would never use Erlang. Professionally, I've programmed in Python using Plone over Zope (commercial-level frameworks) for my university, and PHP for various projects. I guess I can say I know SQL, but I prefer to use database abstraction frameworks for ease of use and extensibility...something like ActiveRecord or SQLAlchemy...although I know my way around SQLite and mySQL enough to hold my own.
I've been in the 'game' for 8 or 9 years now. HTML 4 was 'the big thing' when I started web development, which puts us in the late 90's. I didn't use CSS for a while (good old font, center, bold and italic tags, eh?). I started with server-side scripting somewhere in the early 2000's with PHP. Python is new...I probably have 3 years experience. Ruby is year-and-a-half, and Erlang is something like 1 week 5 weeks ago.
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